NDAA

[LMS]

Goggle this "National Defense Authorization Act", then read and be afraid... be very afraid.
This bill declares the entire USA to be a "battleground" upon which U.S. military forces can operate with impunity, overriding Posse Comitatus and granting the military the unchecked power to arrest, detain, interrogate and even assassinate U.S. citizens with impunity.

[sgath92]

Easily detaining otherwise law abiding citizens seems to be a theme of late between this and SOPA. At least Obama claims that he will veto NDAA, we just have to hope he follows through with it. Also interesting is how both sect 1031 & SOPA have been pretty much ignored by the media overall.

These are the names of the senators who voted against the amendment that would have explicitly exempted American citizens from the bill's proposed detention provision [15 dem's, 44 Repub's and Liberman]:

Alexander (R-TN)
Ayotte (R-NH)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Brown (R-MA)
Burr (R-NC)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coats (R-IN)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Enzi (R-WY)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Hagan (D-NC)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lee (R-UT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
Lugar (R-IN)
Manchin (D-WV)
McCain (R-AZ)
McCaskill (D-MO)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Nelson (D-NE)
Portman (R-OH)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reed (D-RI)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rubio (R-FL)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shaheen (D-NH)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Thune (R-SD)
Toomey (R-PA)
Vitter (R-LA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wicker (R-MS)

[sgath92]

ACLU's statement:

Now, the two bills are in conference committee. The chairmen and ranking members of the Armed Services Committee — known as "the Big Four" — have been having one secret meeting after another over the past few days to quickly write a final bill. Who are the Big Four? From the Senate, it is Sens. Carl Levin (D-Mich.) and John McCain (R-Ariz.) who were the very two who had secretly written the Senate indefinite detention provisions. The third member is the House Armed Services Committee Chairman Buck McKeon (R-Calif.), who is the person who wrote the House indefinite detention provisions without so much as a hearing. And the fourth member is the House Armed Services Committee Ranking Member Adam Smith (D-Wash.), who courageously fought the indefinite detention provisions on the House floor.

That's 3-1 for indefinite military imprisonment without charge or trial. There's good reason to worry about what the Big Four do in their secret meetings.

http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-security/behind-closed-doors-congress-trying-force-indefinite-detention-bill-americans

[Dr.Feelgood]

Europe, here i come!

[sgath92]

Well, it's now signed into law.

As Forbes put it:

“The only provision from which U.S. citizens are exempted here is the“requirement” of military detention,” Greenwald writes. “For foreign nationals accused of being members of Al Qaeda, military detention is mandatory; for U.S. citizens, it is optional. This section does not exempt U.S citizens from the presidential power of military detention: only from the requirement of military detention.”

So if the president, or any president thereafter accuses you of being a terrorist suspect: You can be thrown in prison for life without any kind of trial or charges. They just detain you, and you disappear.

[Dr.Feelgood]

Sounds like Fascism to me. If they can do that lawfully, that why not bring back firing squads! It will save millions of taxpayer dollars on prisoner hospitality and cutdown on prison overcrowding...

[USMC73-93]

Seems to me you are only reading what you want to. You forgot the wording about terrorism, or was 9/11 just another day for you. And before you go digging my military brothers and sisters, it is YOUR president who must authorize it. I will never understand how he got elected when noone will admit to voting for him. I am sick of everyone blaming everything on the military, just remember who gave, no fought for you to have the right to free speech, assembly, religion and countless other rights. How many times have you worked 30-45 days without a day off, 10-12-16 hours a daqy and not one cent more in your check? Well I have, so untill then try thinking before you run your mouth. And learn to read the whole item and understand it before you make yourself look so bad. Yes I proudly served 20 Years in the Marine Corps and I have 2 children in the Air Force that have been to the Middle East so you can walk free. Next time you want to thank someone for something, after you thank God, thank a Vet., he gave you more than anyone else.

[LMS]

Seems to me you are only reading what you want to. You forgot the wording about terrorism, or was 9/11 just another day for you. And before you go digging my military brothers and sisters, it is YOUR president who must authorize it. I will never understand how he got elected when noone will admit to voting for him. I am sick of everyone blaming everything on the military, just remember who gave, no fought for you to have the right to free speech, assembly, religion and countless other rights. How many times have you worked 30-45 days without a day off, 10-12-16 hours a daqy and not one cent more in your check? Well I have, so untill then try thinking before you run your mouth. And learn to read the whole item and understand it before you make yourself look so bad. Yes I proudly served 20 Years in the Marine Corps and I have 2 children in the Air Force that have been to the Middle East so you can walk free. Next time you want to thank someone for something, after you thank God, thank a Vet., he gave you more than anyone else.

Easy there chief, I have zero problem with the fine men and women who serve in the military, they are hero's in my book.
My problem is with an ever growing corrupt government that would try to use those fine men and women against the citizens on the U.S.
I hope that most would refuse such orders and choose instead to stand up for the oath they swore to defend the country and constitution.

And for the record I did NOT vote for Obama, nor have I ever voted for a Democrat. He is NOT my president, he is an asshat who holds the office at the moment.

[USMC73-93]

Thank you for supporting our troops. And yes our troops do have a right to disobey an unlawful order. As for Feelgood, see ya, I hear ther are at least 4 flights to Europe everyday. And take the ACLU with you.

[sgath92]

you to have the right to free speech, assembly, religion and countless other rights.

Not any more. Our rights have been quickly evaporating over the last couple decades, and it isn't the military that has been taking them away.

Due process rights? We don't have any after this bill was created by our congressmen in DC and then signed into law by the president. Assembly? You have to beg for permission from the state first, to get the various necessary licensing, and then they can put your assembly in the middle of nowhere [designated protest zone] where no one will see it or care about it. Speech? Let's see what happens after this SOPA bill is voted on in the coming days. It's not even worth bringing up the subject of dicer subjects like gun ownership, and self defense.

It's not even legal to be homeless anymore for crying out loud. If you're on private property you're "trespassing" and all the public property now tends to have rules on when you can be there & what you can do. Sleeping in a park after-hours will get you sent to jail. Sitting on a side walk at all is illegal in some places in the US now. In some parts of FL you can get arrested for giving a homeless guy a coffee or a burger from mcdonalds.

Real freedom doesn't involve begging for permission from the government first. When the civil rights movement was boycotting buses, did you know that they had the option of hiring a private company to handle their transportation needs? The problem was this required a license. The [local] government responded by saying "It's your own fault you won't take public transit, we're denying your request." The only reason why the boycott was able to go on was because enough people were willing to use their personal vehicles to help people get about.

If it is not fascism [or some other variant of tyranny] for a government to say they can round people up, who are suspected of a crime, with no burden of proof whatsoever, no charges, no trails, and hold them in prison indefinitely: then I don't know what would be!

[LMS]

They won't get my guns without a fight, and when the fight is over they can have them as I will have no more need of them.

Of course just for the record I lost all my guns in a terrible skydiving accident....yeah that's what happened, no need to come around here.

[Dr.Feelgood]

Woah there pal! This had nothing to do with bad mouthing the military. As stated by LMS, it is about the crooked politicians who run a corrupt government that is taking away our freedom. Yes, we may have more freedom than other countries, but those freedoms are dwindling fast... They call this the land of the free right? Well, it is if your from another country. The California dream act was recently passed which allows foreigners with little money, to go to school for free!(on the states dime). When I have to pay full price, plus extra for said foreigners. The government wants to seem so inviting when it cannot even take care of its own citizens and fix its own problems...

3 of my 4 grandparents were in the military, I have 3 close friends in the navy, and 3 in the Air Force. I was to join the Air force my self... I have no problem with the military, however it seems you have a probelm with me. Spit it out before my flight leaves!