Custom Wheels and Tires

[JonBrewer1981]

I want to put a set of aftermarket/custom wheels and tires on my 65 caddy anyone have any info on this. I need to know what I should be looking for such as offset etc... I believe the wheel is 5x5. What size wheels do you have on yours? I was hopeing to get 18"or20"
Any info will be helpfull, Thanks

[hotroddwayne]

For the least amount of hassle I recommend 15" x 7" with stock offset. Yes you need the 5 on 5" lug pattern (big GM). I run back tires 3 sizes bigger than on the front, and speaking from experience if you go bigger than a 255/70/R15 on the back they WILL rub, especially since you're putting them on a coach with fender skirts. Front tires are 225/70/R15 and barely clear the top fender lip on hard turns on the '66 ambo. When you remove your rear rims you'll find wheel spacers, leave them alone if you run the 15" x 7" because once you install them with the recommended tire you can barely get your fingers (laid flat) between the skirt & tire. As for the hooptie 18's & 20's have no idea there, a wheel shop can figure that stuff out. I've ran this wheel/tire combo on several coaches with no troubles & it's a great look. NOTE! MAKE SURE you check the weight rating of whatever wheel you select! My Torque-Thrusts are rated at 1600lbs apiece so the 7200lb ambo is overloaded on these wheels, but new rims will be in next week & they're rated at 2100lbs each. Nothing worse than going into a turn & have a rim blow apart on you. All newer wheels have the weight rating cast into the back of them. Photos for reference of my coaches for you, they are ALL the above mentioned setup, hope this helps:

[Creepy Cruiser]

I agree with hotroddwayne, if you just want bolt on with no mods, don't go wider than a 7". I put 15x8.5's on my 65 when I first got it, but I had to remove the mounts that hold the skirts on, and then weld studs on the back and bolt them on from the inside. I can't even start to tell you how much fabrication it took, to get the 15x10's to tuck all the way around that I have on there right now, lol.

You can kinda see how far the 15x8.5's stick out in this first pic, (with no spacers), the skirt after it was modded just barely fit.



And here it is with the 4 wheel disk brakes and 15x10's stuffed front and rear.

[R U INJRD]

Get your hands on one of these:

http://www.jegs.com/i/Percy%26%23039...01201/10002/-1

or, better yet, study the pictures and build your own like I did out of aluminum. The cool thing about this is you can set it up to simulate the wheel and tire you want to use, then bolt it to the hub and run it around to see if it will hit anything. This is especially helpful up front, because you can turn the steering wheel full lock, then spin the hub and see if you run into any interference. It's easy to tell if a wheel and tire is going to hit when it is going straight, but not so much if you have the wheels turned without something like this.

[JonBrewer1981]

If I go with 15" x 7" what is the stock offset and what amount of backspacing should I be looking for?
Thanks for the helpful information.
hotroddwayne - just wanted to say all your coaches look really good, hope mine looks that good one day, thanks for posting the pics.
creepy - I know you have probably heard it a million times but all I can say about your car is Awesome, Love It

[Creepy Cruiser]

Thanks, it's been a great project. You can get there too, just keep at it, you can make it happen.

Like "R U INJRD" said, it really does help if you build one of those, if you're looking for just the right fitment,(I built a cool one too). I've even had to build them on the fly, out of a 2x4 and some paint sticks, lol.

It all depends on the look you're going for. (new school vs old school), as to what size wheels you want to make fit. Keep in mind though, that cool 15" tires, are getting harder and harder to find every day.

[Flymanj3]

Get your hands on one of these:

http://www.jegs.com/i/Percy%26%23039...01201/10002/-1

or, better yet, study the pictures and build your own like I did out of aluminum. The cool thing about this is you can set it up to simulate the wheel and tire you want to use, then bolt it to the hub and run it around to see if it will hit anything. This is especially helpful up front, because you can turn the steering wheel full lock, then spin the hub and see if you run into any interference. It's easy to tell if a wheel and tire is going to hit when it is going straight, but not so much if you have the wheels turned without something like this.

OK, looks good on paper (or Comp screen) but... thinking about it, you do have to jack the car up from the axle or control arm to load the suspension or you'll get a false sence of spacing - correct?

[R U INJRD]

Correct, but that's not usually too hard to do. On a pro-car it's a little more difficult because they're so long, you want to be careful not to torque the frame too much or you can bust a windshield.

It may seem expensive, but it's not as expensive as getting stuck with wheels that don't fit and you can't return. The first time you do that you're probably gonna lose $100 just reselling them to someone else. And it really wasn't that hard to make one from scrap aluminum anyway. You could make something similar out of wood too. The nice thing is it's adjustable, so you can use it over and over again. I've seen people make measuring devices out of a disc of plywood with a stick on it to represent the tire width, but you need different discs for different sizes.

Backspacing isn't a hard concept to understand, but there's no shortage of people who screw it up. Just means more discounted wheels and tires for the rest of us...

[hotroddwayne]

If I go with 15" x 7" what is the stock offset and what amount of backspacing should I be looking for?
Thanks for the helpful information.
hotroddwayne - just wanted to say all your coaches look really good, hope mine looks that good one day, thanks for posting the pics.
creepy - I know you have probably heard it a million times but all I can say about your car is Awesome, Love It

All you need to say for the wheels is "I want a set of 4 wheels, 15" x 7" with stock offset & 5 on 5" lug pattern" you don't need to give any other info or numbers. Off-the-shelf wheels are sold in stock offset, special offsets are special order & made to your specs. This is where you get into positive & negative offsets & you only need to worry about that if you go with big rims.

Thanks for the compliment! Will post up pix of the ambulance as soon as the new wheels get here.
This is what I went with, the new Cragar 500G

[DeadInjuns]

I really like this wheel Dwayne, very nice choice, they will look great on that ambulance! I'm looking forward to seeing the pics when you get them on.

[Uglybastard239]

Well, it looks like I'm going to have to put new tires on my 88 Fleetwood. The Michelins that are on it are apparently starting to dry rot. I'd like to put new rims on it as well, because the centers for my stock 14 inch caddy rims have a red emblem that I don't like with my blue hearse, plus the center rings have developed a corrosion that I have to figure out how to get off. So I figure if I'm going to get new rubber I may as well put new rims on at the same time.

After looking at the 500G's that Hotroddwayne is getting I decided to take a look at Cragar's myself. I like the 15 inch Soft 8 line (and the low price tag doesn't suck either) though I'm torn between the Black and the Chrome. My biggest question is going with bigger tires on the back. Summit Racing has Mastercraft Avengers in 225 and 255. The 255s have a MUCH higher weight rating than the 225s. Can I put the 255s on the front of an 88 or will I have to have different tires on the front and back? Different size tires are going to make getting them rotated an impossibility, not to mention what do I use for a spare?

Also if I put 255s on the back can I put a load in the back without any rubbing problems?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Glenn

[hotroddwayne]

Well, it looks like I'm going to have to put new tires on my 88 Fleetwood. The Michelins that are on it are apparently starting to dry rot. I'd like to put new rims on it as well, because the centers for my stock 14 inch caddy rims have a red emblem that I don't like with my blue hearse, plus the center rings have developed a corrosion that I have to figure out how to get off. So I figure if I'm going to get new rubber I may as well put new rims on at the same time.

After looking at the 500G's that Hotroddwayne is getting I decided to take a look at Cragar's myself. I like the 15 inch Soft 8 line (and the low price tag doesn't suck either) though I'm torn between the Black and the Chrome. My biggest question is going with bigger tires on the back. Summit Racing has Mastercraft Avengers in 225 and 255. The 255s have a MUCH higher weight rating than the 225s. Can I put the 255s on the front of an 88 or will I have to have different tires on the front and back? Different size tires are going to make getting them rotated an impossibility, not to mention what do I use for a spare?

Also if I put 255s on the back can I put a load in the back without any rubbing problems?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Glenn

Ok you may have made a typing error in saying you have 14" rims on an '88 Fleetwood, they should be 15" unless you have a front-wheel-drive. As for your tire question, don't put 255/70 tires on the front, it will look like a 4 x 4 and will rub like crazy! 255 is the sidewall height, the higher the number the taller the tire. If you're worried about tire rotation & want all 4 the same, go with the 225 but be warned they'll look wimpy (small) on the coach & not fill out the tire openings like they should. Tire rub on the back with 255/70's & a heavy load? YES unless you trick your load leveling system to counteract the sag of the rear. Look at the pix of my 1980 S&S Victoria hearse, it has 255/70/R15 tires on the back & I "tricked" my load leveling system to keep the rear shocks pumped up higher than normal because the tires are so close to rubbing it's scary when the shocks are down... and things do tend to move around when cornering so why take the chance. I also like the "raked" stance so the rear is slightly higher than the front.
Here's how I look at your situation: If your coach is for pleasure & it's your "toy" you drive occasionally, who cares about being practical, put some new mags on it with "bigs & littles" tire combo. If it's a daily driver that you use for everything & needs to be practical, then keep it more driveable with all 4 tires the same size so you can rotate them. Hell I run Firestone Firehawk "Indy 500" series white letter tires & they're less than $460 for a set mounted & balanced for the bigs & littles combo, so if the fronts wear uneven they're only $106 apiece, rears are $12 more.
As for a spare, rely on a standard spare. You have no choice but to run it if you have a blowout. It may lean a little but it won't be on there very long. You oughta have a blowout on a pro-street sometime... man does it look like ASS & drive funny with a standard tire on one side & a giant/wide deep dish on the other! The 255's have a higher weight rating because they're a much larger tire than a 225. PM me if you still need some help with your decision.

[Uglybastard239]

Well, for the record I did type that in correctly. My 88 S&S, IS front wheel drive and it DOES have 14 inch tires on it, but don't feel bad my local tire guy had a hard time believing they were 14s while he was looking at 'em. My coach is for pleasure in as much as I'm not intending to haul any dead bodies about, but I would like to keep that option available once I get her completely restored. I DO however put my kids (regularly) and other family members (occasionally) in the back, I can't seem to keep them out. I've temporarily mounted a fold-able Windstar Seat onto the rollers so the kids have someplace to sit. I've had 5 people (plus me) in her at one time and she sat VERY low in the back that day.

I also drive the Hell out this vehicle, I don't drive her EVERY day, but I drive it so much my friends tell me I'm going to weep when I finally wear something out. So far I haven't had anything but good luck with the 4.5 liter motor, she doesn't get the best mileage (still better than a Hummer), but she's damned peppy and she's even beaten a couple of jerk kids off the line. Unfortunately, the tranny will eventually need rebuilt as the inner seals seem to be wearing out and I get a "bump" on the downshift from 2nd to 1st.

How would one go about "tricking the self-leveling system and will it do any permanent damage to the system? I really like the way your 80 looks. Mine has VERY similar lines and I would like to achieve something similar. Rotating the tires isn't the end all be all, but functionality is. I want her to look good, but running smooth and safe is MUCH more important...did I mention I put my kids in this thing? Of course they're also fighting over who gets the hearse when I die...which is starting to make me nervous.

[hotroddwayne]

When it comes to front wheel drive ALL the rules change. Front wheel drives have a totally different offset to the wheels & I can offer no advice to you for wheels & tires. On a rear wheel drive the offset is basically centered... the wheels have depth both on the inside & the outside. On yours almost all the depth is on the inside, so your situation is more complicated because of this offset issue.
As for tricking the load leveling system, you can do it two ways. There should be a switch on the rear suspension that's easy to find. Once the rear of the car sags this switch engages & activates the air pump for your air shocks, so if your pump is good you can change the angle of the switch to "trick" the car so the pump engages sooner... keeping it up higher in the back than normal. The other way is to install a line kit & disable your air pump (unplug it), that way you can manually fill the rear shocks to your desired height. My load leveling system has a complicated air system & both shocks have 2 lines instead of one each, yet only a single air line off the compressor... so I disabled the pump & bought an air shock line kit, capped one side of the tee fitting filler valve in the kit, & put the other end of this tee on the single line running back to the rear. Now I manually fill this valve with my shop air compressor & the coach always sits where I want it. Aftermarket air shocks are much more simple, only one line to each shock & then those 2 lines go into the tee fitting/filler valve.
Not many of us on here have front wheel drive coaches, but maybe someone will chime in with some wheel/tire recommendations for you.

[Uglybastard239]

Ok, I called Summit Racing a couple of weeks ago and talked to the salesperson. Turns out that as an added bonus Cadillac used a 5 x 115mm bolt pattern and they only used THAT pattern for a year or two. As you may have guessed this presents quite the problem for obtaining aftermarket rims. They only had 1 vendor that carried rims in that bolt pattern. They're Eagle Alloys. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AEW-1929-5615/ and they've got 10 in stock. Unfortunately, I think they're ugly as a mud fence, pricey AND they've got a rather low weight limit...but they've got 10 of 'em. That should count for something I suppose.

Anyway, here's my question. Can I get the lug pattern changed to a 5x5? Seems like it ought to be a fairly easy switch, but I'm not sure if it's even possible...and if it is will it affect their ability to support the weight?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Glenn